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#21 [url]

Nov 30 10 5:12 PM

Hi Org.
You will need a plastic container, that is practically indestructible. The best thing to do is send it express, which will arrive at my lab.  I will look on line to see if I can find something we can use as a fixative for now. The package must be very secure for obvious reasons.
The package should be labeled as "nutrient supplement" (it's true technically). You will have to use bubble wrap and make sure it is very secure.
If this can be done, let me know.        SM

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#22 [url]

Dec 1 10 12:02 AM

Thanks Shroom for your mail,

No problems getting the sample in a super tough plastic container sent over express in bubble wrap. Just the fixative I have no knowledge of. 

I'm off to Thailand (live in Japan) from Dec 12th till Jan 4th and was hoping to send it off before then. Or maybe I should wait until I return...maybe I'll pick up something more over there??

Organika 

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#23 [url]

Dec 1 10 3:32 PM

I suggest you send it now, in order for me to get the work started.
Otherwise, you could start into treatment for liver fluke and if there are more problems, do the test at a later date.
My address is Um Micrographic
                      193 College St.
                      Toronto, ON Canada
                      M5T 1P9

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#24 [url]

Dec 2 10 5:41 AM

Apologies, I just checked my time line and I have treated myself with Prazi, Albendazole and Egaten for flukes since I had my latest Metametrix profile. I understand it doesn't necessarily mean I am rid of them but I hope to get some answers before I self prescribe anything other than supplements/tea/homeopathics.

In any case, isn't a fixative to put my sample in of utmost importance? That's what I gathered reading the Metametrix website.

Please inform...Thanks, Organika

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#25 [url]

Dec 2 10 5:03 PM

It's important because if there are eggs, sometimes the bacteria will digest them.
But, if there are fluke hatching, they will survive for a while, and even grow.
I don't like to disturb the samples too much, and usually just use water. But, that is for immediate observation.
If you want to wait, I can source the fixative, and send you a kit. Not sure how long that will take though.
You could send a sample anyway, and I can see if there is anything unusual going on. I have a pretty good eye for that now.      Shroom                 PS if you want to email me direct, the address is info@ummicrographic.com     

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#26 [url]

Jan 18 11 7:41 PM

While MetaMetrix cannot guarantee positive match, can't it describe the "cluster" of organic life form to which the parasite belongs?  For instance, it should be able to give the parasite a rough classification.  "PPTU" seems like such an easy way out.

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#27 [url]

Jun 30 11 4:36 PM

Hi, I'm new to this forum.  I've had 4 Metametrix tests over the past year and a half - 3 of them (including the last two) came back with PPTU, and the other with D. fragilis. One of the posts (I can't find it now - there ought to be a simpler search function) mentioned antimicrobial peptides.  I'm willing to try anything, because I haven't had much luck with herbs (Paraguard and artemisinin help somewhat to make the pain more bearable, but do not eliminate the symptoms.  Alinia, Flagyl, Paramomycin, and Yodoxin didn't help at all. Tinidazole helped the best; I felt much better for a few months. But after I took some Cipro for a UTI, the digestive symptoms (abdominal pain on the lower left side, loose and frequent stools, huge weight loss, bloating and flatulence) got really bad again.  So here I am, back to square one.  And my doctors won't prescribe any more Tinidazole.  You'd think I was asking for an endless supply of Oxycontin!  I just want to get rid of my parasite!

So my question is, what sort of peptides should I take, and where do I buy them?

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#28 [url]

Jun 30 11 8:32 PM

Hi thisland:    Welcome to the forum.  Your input (and all members) are vital for resolving these problems. 

#1  your experience with common herbs are typical.  

#2  could you clarify if you did the drugs one at a time or in combination.  

#3  Shroom (zarrfreak) mentioned the exact phenomena about taking abx then seeing a reoccurence of symptomology -  perhaps he can comment.   Which gets me thinking if there are species of bacteria that directly kill off protozoa or if reducing the population of bacteria weakens the immune response.

#4  Tinindazole is related to Flagyl but with less side effects and a close cousin to Secnindazole which also has fewer side-effects than Flagyl.   You can obtain these legally thru MedsMex or Magic Pharma which are trusted pharmacies.  This is why many do not bother obtaining scripts from doctors due to the bureaucracy.  

#5  I put 'peptides' in the google search bar and returned the post you are looking for

http://pptu.lefora.com/2011/06/14/antimicrobial-peptides/

I am no expert on peptides, but from what I understand they are manufactured in the body and cannot be obtained otherwise - but perhaps I am wrong.  It would important to keep the nutritional levels high so that the body will be able to produce these and other important immune factors. 

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#29 [url]

Jul 1 11 12:24 PM

#2 clarification - 10 days of Flagyl was first, combined with Clarithromycin and Prilosec (My regular doctor said I had an ulcer caused by H pylori).  Afterwards the symptoms got worse.
Months later (after the first Metametrix test and finding of PPTU plus pinworms) I took Mebendazole which killed the worms.  Weeks later Alinia by itself.  That made the pain worse while I was taking it, but it subsided back to the "normal" amount of pain when I finished.
Next (after test #2 came back with D. fragilis, but NOT PPTU!) I took Tinidazole 250mg twice a day for 10 days, plus Yodoxin 650mg thrice a day for 20 days.  (I’m allergic to tetracycline)  The pills worsened my diarrhea, but otherwise I actually felt better while on the Tindamax!  The pain was significantly reduced, and it seemed like I had more energy, too!  But after I finished the Tindamax, and was just on Yodoxin, the pain went back to “usual” again.  I don’t think the Yodoxin helped at all. After test #3 (PPTU) my other doctor prescribed more Tinidazole (1000mg twice a day for 7 days, plus Humatin (500 mg 3x per day for 7 days).  I finished that round, and soon felt a lot better, but unfortunately it didn’t eradicate my infection.  I still had abdominal pain and the “weird stools”.  But the pain was like 90 percent better until I took some Cipro for a UTI.  Now I'm back to square one!  What's the deal with Tinidazole?  Why are the doctors so reluctant to try it again?  That was the one thing that helped the most!  I just had test #4, and of course it says PPTU again...

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#30 [url]

Nov 30 11 1:48 AM

It took 3 stool samples to find charcot-leyden crystals which could be a worm or amoeba infection like E. histyolica.  Can you find liver flukes on an ultra sound? 
that sounds pretty scary to think of flukes loose in your blood stream or your liver
I've been trying this milk diet with gallons of milk and some pineapple and neem and getting a lot of diarrhea and then I saw this one lone red tomato skin rolled up in my stool

flagyl seems to work for me but it took at least 10 days- the blood in my stool that I had for 15 years is gone
maybe you just have to avoid all seafood, especially crab and snails which are in the life cycle of amoebas like EH.  I got sick after eating a lobster sandwich last year and vomitted

fresh pineapple kills worms in some studies- it has an enzyme but only when it is fresh
 



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#31 [url]

Nov 30 11 3:13 AM



rolled up tomato skins are a very common observation from those suffering with flukes -   If you have insurance I would ask your doctor to test antibodies for this -  have you done the Metametrix test?


typically you stronger approaches in dealing with flukes - prazaquintal is one (fasinex? is another) outoftime knows something about these -   I heard reports of people eradicating these with MMS -  but you have to follow the MMS guidelines carefully.  

CDC info on flukes > http://dpd.cdc.gov/dpdx/html/Fascioliasis.htm

click on the top tabs at the cdc site for more information, here is what they say about treatment

Clinical Features:During the acute phase (caused by the migration of the immature fluke through the hepatic parenchyma), manifestations include abdominal pain, hepatomegaly, fever, vomiting, diarrhea, urticaria and eosinophilia, and can last for months.  In the chronic phase (caused by the adult fluke within the bile ducts), the symptoms are more discrete and reflect intermittent biliary obstruction and inflammation.  Occasionally, ectopic locations of infection (such as intestinal wall, lungs, subcutaneous tissue, and pharyngeal mucosa) can occur.

Laboratory Diagnosis:Microscopic identification of eggs is useful in the chronic (adult) stage.  Eggs can be recovered in the stools or in material obtained by duodenal or biliary drainage.  They are morphologically indistinguishable from those of Fasciolopsis buski.  False fascioliasis (pseudofascioliasis) refers to the presence of eggs in the stool resulting not from an actual infection but from recent ingestion of infected livers containing eggs.  This situation (with its potential for misdiagnosis) can be avoided by having the patient follow a liver-free diet several days before a repeat stool examination.  Antibody detection tests are useful especially in the early invasive stages, when the eggs are not yet apparent in the stools, or in ectopic fascioliasis.

Diagnostic findings

Treatment:Unlike infections with other flukes, Fasciola hepatica infections may not respond to praziquantel.  The drug of choice is triclabendazole with bithionol as an alternative.  For additional information, see the recommendations in The Medical Letter (Drugs for Parasitic Infections).




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#32 [url]

Nov 30 11 8:19 PM

Thanks so much!  there's so much I don't know about parasites

this is an article on fresh pineapple juice which can kill worms in experiment
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,762680,00.html
the older pineapple doesn't work for some reason.  apparently it is the bromelain which is the chemical ingredient that kills worms

I switched to aciphex from nexium after reading that article on aciphex's greater effectiveness against amoebas

 

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#33 [url]

Dec 1 11 2:39 AM

ejhang:  could you post these questions under the General category - thanks.   I will be moving your threads over to that area soon.   I doubt pineapple could kill flukes - I think they are a little tougher than worms, I would think something stronger would be necessary. 

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#34 [url]

Dec 4 11 10:26 PM

The latest stool analysis of my child has shown growth of Streptococcus in it. My doctor recommended an antibiotic, which made my child worse. What should we do?

 

I have to tell most of my patients not to rely on testing too much. Every test can only identify what it knows; it cannot find what it has not been designed to find. It is a fact that little knowledge can be more dangerous than no knowledge at all. There are many potentially pathogenic microbes in human stool and in the gut flora. The fact that the laboratory identified one of them does not mean that we must go chasing after it. Trying to kill streptococci with antibiotics we would kill many beneficial bacteria and activate other pathogens, which could have been dormant, and which may be far more dangerous than the streptococci. So, in the big picture in the gut the antibiotic would do more harm than good. We are dealing with an immensely complex microbial world in the gut, which we only just started learning about. We know very little yet, our modern science is in its infancy on this subject. That is why it is best to rely on centuries old wisdom of treating the gut holistically with diet and probiotics, giving it time and patience. 


Taken from http://www.gapsdiet.com/FAQs.html


Dr. Natasha Campbell-McBride.  

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#36 [url]

Jan 6 12 11:09 PM

So I wrote to Metametrix asking about whether they might make any more taxonomies available, thus replacing some of the "PPTU" results with something more specific.  Here's the reply:


We are planning on adding more parasite targets to the GI Function Profile in the next year or so. Specifically, we are interested in adding Microsporidia species as these are known to cause pathogenesis in humans. We are always interested in identifying new parasite targets that would help clinicians manage their patients.

http://www.medicinenet.com/microsporidiosis/article.htm

Keep in mind that PPTU can include parasites that colonize other animals such as fish, dogs, cats, mice, insects, etc…These are not considered a threat to the human GI tract and are therefore not on our list of parasite targets.


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#38 [url]

Feb 16 12 7:18 PM

Has anyone asked Metametrix for more details as to exactly how they perform the DNA/PCR testing and true accuracy and false positive/negative mechanisms exist given their method.  For example, what and who's equipment do they use? I think most of us are so used to watching CSI and know just enough about DNA to see it as the Gold Standard for positives. Is it really true for Metametrix and why don't other labs do this if its so accurate? What is the probability of a wrong identification? Is it like CSI's 1 in 100 Billion or 1 in 20?

In concept its easy to understand that if the equipment finds some DNA and multiplies it via PCR and then compares specific highly unique sections to the known DNA patterns for the common parasites and gets a match, it seems like a no-brainer. Failure to find some DNA could simply mean the physically didn't encounter it because the critter was hiding away from the stool. There is also lots of non-parasite and some animal parasite DNA floating around our guts and the equipment must PCR all DNA and then eliminate everything not on the parasite list provided by the manufacturer of the DNA processing equipment.

Why am I curious about all this? Is the Metametrix DNA test actually very accurate? What are is weakness's? What causes false positives or false negatives?  I took their tests 3 times and got some pretty odd results.


10.17.11
Blastocystis hominis Positive
Parasite present; taxonomy unavailable. Positive

12.14.11
Entamoeba sp. Positive
Parasite present; taxonomy unavailable. Positive

1.17.12
Blastocystis hominis Positive
Necator americanus (hookworm) Positive
Parasite present; taxonomy unavailable Positive

On all 3 I got PPTU - very consistent 3 for 3
On 2 I got my BH but it was gone for the middle one replaced by Entamoeba sp so 2 for 3
Then my BH came back with a Hookworm.

This causes me too lose some faith in them. Does anyone know exactly how they perform the test and what mechanisms of weakness it has? Its a bummer I got 3 for 3 on the UNKNOWN! My BH mysteriously disappeared and came back while a hookworm joined in for the middle showing.

Anybody have this kind of experience?

Any thoughts would be helpful :)

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#39 [url]

Feb 16 12 11:20 PM

europa:  Thanks for posting this.  See if this helps  http://www.metametrix.com/learning-center/articles/2011/new-molecular-techniques-revolutionize-understanding-of-gut-microbiota-influence-on-health-and-disease

Concerning the variation in test results, I have seen this a few times which has raised some questions.  I don't know if this is due to newness of the technology?  In my opinion, it still appears to be the best test available.   

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#40 [url]

Mar 10 12 6:53 PM

Hi,

I put in curezone a paper about other protozoa that were BELIEVED to not infect the gastro tract but they were found responsible for many gastro diseases. I think this paper could explain why some of us had PPTU.  PPTU is different from one to another and SHOULD not be treated the same way UNLESS there is no possible identification method and then a serious PROTOCOL should be followed.

The problem with herbal treatments is that many herbs are not found in all the places and also they are not standarized with their actif ingredient.

Yahia

microscopiccreatures lefora forum.

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